Black tank questions

GlennWest · 07-08-2009, 12:22 PM

Even after dumping my black tank it still reads at 2/3 level. I'm having to dump it every 2 to 3 days. My wife freaks out when it states full. Also start getting odor when it states full. Is my tank rather small or what? I can't find any specs on my coach on MS site. Just 09 models. Even then I don't see tank sizes. We do use a lot of water flushing. Rather paranoid about this tank getting stopped up.

rdunk · 07-08-2009, 02:10 PM

Glenn, our black tank is 50 gal. Yes, the tank sensors often become dirty and not read correctly. Do you use any type of chemical in your tank? Some of the chemicals can help with both the smell and breaking down the "stuff" that can "cloud" the sensors. When the tank gets pretty full, the smell does creep out when flushing the toilet, especially when the vent fan is running. That is also a pretty good indicator of the need to flush the tank. I do find that the near filling of the black tank a couple of times when flushing helps clean the sensors.

How often you need to flush has a lot to do with how much water is kept in the toilet. While these toilets can be flushed with very small amounts of water, many of our DWs (dear wives) like to fill them like a stick house toilet (with a lot of water). Thus, the likely need to flush every 3 or 4 days!

Gemstone · 07-08-2009, 02:42 PM

I haven't used the sensors almost since day one, when I found them to be unreliable....my new sensor is much more accurate.

"Dear, I think the black tank needs to be emptied !"

Works every time.

Regards
Gemstone

JOHN EVANS · 07-08-2009, 03:55 PM

every couple of months when on the road we dump calgon water softner and a cup of laundry soap into both gray and black tanks along with a about 5 gals of water .while moveing down the road this mixture cleans the tanks and sensors. you would be suprised what comes out of the tanks when you dump them, it looks like a tar mixture. we also use a holding tank treatment called piranha 1 oz per 10 gals mucher to use then most tank treatments

billr · 07-08-2009, 07:41 PM

The cup of Tide in the tank 1/2 full and a couple bags of ice will do a good job cleaning the tank as you move to a new campground.

For routine maint, I try to wait at least 5-6 days or more before I dump the black tank. It will get a much better dumpout that way. You can always hook up the black water flush and fill the tank if you need to dump sooner.

Use a clear fitting on the hookup to see when it runs clear and clean after flushing. Some folks swear by No chemicals, we always use them. So your choice. We have no odor (unless the tank is realy full!, and the exhaust fan is on when you flush!) ha

The sensors are pretty usless!

Bill

5thwheeler · 07-08-2009, 09:04 PM

Travis (previous owner of this forum) installed a set of SeeLevel Guages. I'm considering doing the same thing. Fresh water sensor will be the most difficult, but it doesn't usually get dirty.

For more info, check out:

http://www.5thwheelforums.com/index1.html

golf_bears · 07-09-2009, 05:51 PM

The SeeLevel gauges work really well. We had them installed at DRV when our unit was being built so not sure how much of a problem it may be to install after the unit is built.

The original gauges on our unit that DRV normally installs are gunked up, especially the black tank, and do not function well. We only rely on the SeeLevel gauges and have not encountered any problems. We have learnt to trust the Seelevel gauge readings.

If you can get the SeaLevel gauges installed after the fact, I would suggest they are well worth the cost.

Thom · 07-15-2009, 02:02 AM

I surrendered to the gauges not reading accurately within two weeks of moving into our 36 TK3. I did look into the sea level gauges and if there was a way to get them installed at a reasonable cost I would jump at it but with the way our units are built after the fact installations are at the least very difficult. We stay in one location without moving for 4 to 7 months at a time and good reading gauges just will not happen. water use is always a problem where we go so I just dump every 7 to 10 days and dump two or three 6 gallon buckets down to flush it out then go with that. The bottom of the tank seems to be clean and the hose seems to be flushed . So thats what I will go with. I have run the flush at 100 psi for 45 min and it still did not clean the gauges one time, not enough water or dumping space since. so we live with it for now

Thom

rverdlm · 07-16-2009, 09:30 AM

Thom is right, the best way to keep the black tank clean is to pour a couple of buckets of water down the toilet as fast as you can every time you dump. After you do this you should be able to shine a flashlite down the toilet and see the bottom of the tank is clean. If not dump more water until it is clean. If it's clean there will be no odor while you're looking down the toilet. We've been full time for 14 years and we use no chemicals and have no odor. I know when the toilet is full because the noise when flushing changes. I dump every week, but can go over 2 weeks when we don't have a sewer hook-up.

The Spices · 08-08-2009, 11:26 AM

I am thinking about the same thing - having DRV install a SeeLevel system when they build ours. As much for a more accurate reading of the level as reliability. Can you tell me which model gauge you used?
Thanks
Retirementbound

**wingnut60** · 08-08-2009, 05:08 PM

This is the most disagreeable part of the RV life, but can be managed well without much odor. Flushing would go much better if the jet was lower in the tank--it misses most of the buildup. Looking down the toilet with a flashlight is the best way to assure the main buildup is gone, and a quick pour of lots of water down the toilet is one of the best ways to dislodge the solids. I usually let the tank fill most of the way before flushing and takes over a week with only the two of us before reaching that point. I always let the fluid level rise to the flush jet before opening the dump valve, then repeat and repeat until clean. Using a bag of ice, about 10 gal water and some Dawn/Calgon while moving to the next campsite will always finish anything the flushing missed. The only time I have an odor is when the vent fan OR the interior vents are in use while the toilet valve is open. And the tank sensors are useless also.

Motor31 · 08-09-2009, 11:41 AM

Our black tank sensors have been useless since 2 months after we got the rig. That's no big deal to us as we know from use that we can go for 8 days before dumping. I use a clear plastic elbow on the line to determine when the flush is complete. I usually close the valve for a minute then drain it with the flush going to build up water and clean out the tank at least 3 times. When done I close the valve for 15 to 30 seconds depending on water pressure / flow to add water to the black tank for the next week. We also put a couple loads of laundry worth of water in the grey tank to flush out the hose.

GlennWest · 08-09-2009, 03:47 PM

We've been adding detergent to our black tank, Clorox and hooked up the flush system and ran it for about an hour and my sensors work now. Going to keep this up. We're making progress. I opened the flush valve on commode and tried to see what was going on in there with the back flush and it smelled awful while running that back flush. Must have been breaking up the build up.

rjohnsonnm · 08-09-2009, 05:14 PM

I do exactly what Motor 31 wrote, with the addition of doing a complete flush about once a month. I do this by sticking a hose with a flushing wand on the end and sticking it down into the tank thru the comnode. I do it at the same time that I have the backflush running. I made a change to the flushing wand that you get at the RV stores. They come with 4 holes at 90 degree angles. I replaced the end with a PVC cap in which I drilled only 2 holes 180 degrees apart and then rotate it around while shining a flashlight down the hole. This gives maximum spray pressure and when I'm done the sensors work. I also do this when I get home and I am going to store the RV for awhile. When it is all really clean and totally drained I leave both dump valves open so air can get in and dry them out so stuff doesn't grow for the 3-5 months I'm at home.

Also, I don't add chemicals (waste of money because the black tank is only a holding tank and doesn't need to have the stuff eaten by enzymes) and I also use Sam's Club TP and have never had a bit of trouble. After all, it's all going out a 3" hole. Been doing it now for 4 years of 6-8 months per year on the road. The enzymes and expensive TP are scams that take a lot of extra money for no reason.

GlennWest · 08-09-2009, 05:36 PM

We bought our MS used and tank was issue when we got it. Previous owner used it for vacationing. We full time in our coach and once we get it cleaned out I believe we can kept it clean with the information I learned on this site. Thanks everyone.

Jack in Alaska · 08-15-2009, 06:00 PM

Using plenty (a reasonable amout)of water when flushing the toilet, dumping once per week, usually Sun. morning, watching it go away through the clear adapter and having the built-in in tank water spritzer going while dumping has worked for us. This is when parked for long term.
When traveling I dump every 3 days after putting in excess water the 2nd day and dump as soon as we stop and hook up, not after setting alll night.
My fluid level sensors have never worked after the 1st tank full on this RV or any of the previous eight Rv's I have owned. You just learn to live without them.

GlennWest · 08-15-2009, 07:28 PM

Actually the fresh and gray sensors work great. Just the black is wrong. By the way, it's reporting wrong again. Oh well.

BillA · 09-19-2009, 06:04 PM

Have a basic question. We are having the same problem everyone else is with the black tank sensor reading partially full when it is empty. I would like to try dumping a couple of 5 gallon buckets of water down the commode but wonder how to hold the electric flush valve open for longer than a normal flush to accomplish this task?

Motor31 · 09-20-2009, 09:58 AM

Bill you can use the black tank flush hose fitting to do that. Time how long it takes to fill the 5 gallon bucket from the hose then double that time flowing water into the black tank with the dump valve closed. That should add between 5 to 10 gallons into the tank.

When I dump I close the black tank valve and let the water flow into the tank for at least 15 to 30 seconds depending on water pressure to add water to the tank before use. So far it has worked well to help keep the tank dumping freely at the end of the week. Since we full time we dump every 7 to 8 days and ignore the tank sensors. They were accurate only for the first 2 or 3 weeks we had the trailer.

RodeWorthy · 09-20-2009, 09:20 PM

Bill there are two ways I know of to keep the ball valve open on the Concerto electric flush toilet. If you remove the lid at the back of the toilet you will notice a rod sticking up. Pushing that down will cause a manual flush. It would be a good idea to pull the fuse before trying this.

The other way requires two people but it involves pulling the fuse but holding it against the fuse holder while your helper initiates a flush. When the ball opens you can pull the fuse away from the holder to stop the action. Replacing the fuse will cause the cycle to complete and the ball will close.

I actually prefer the second option. The rod seems to be tricky and the rotating parts on the flush valve are finely adjusted and sensitive.

On my unit the fuse was not marked but my Concerto was an add-on, not standard as in your Elite. Trial and error found the right fuse. Hope this helps.