Letter from DRV-Tom Peck

David Schwertner · 09-03-2011, 12:37 PM

Today, I received the following letter from Tom Peck.

" Several owners of model year 08-11 DRV vehicles have experienced loosening of the wheel clamping system. Incidents are detected as recurring looseness (requiring frequent tightening) or as multiple stud fractures. In the most serious cases, all eight of the wheel mounting studs have fractured. In extreme cases, where all studs have fractured, the wheel has seperated from the vehicle."
Wants us to make sure to torque wheel nuts for 16" rims (9/16"studs) to 120-125 lb-ft. and 17.5 rims (5/8"studs) to 125-150 lb-ft.

A 3 page letter. Just wondering if any one else received this letter? Letter dated August 25,2011.

David

ponch · 09-07-2011, 12:02 PM

One other note that I would like to make is that on Aluminum wheels
you should torque normally then drrive about 50 miles then retorque. This will normally reset the lug and normally they will not loosen up.

USA in a Chevrolet · 09-07-2011, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ponch

One other note that I would like to make is that on Aluminum wheels
you should torqus normally will set the lug and it will not back offe again after 50 miles. This will reset the lug and normally they will not loosen up.

Sorry but I do not understand your sentence. Could you explain furhter?

Motor31 · 09-08-2011, 08:51 AM

When I had my bearings checked shortly after purchase in 05 by a Dexter rep, he explained the torque process. If the tires is removed reinstall and torque to 150 lbs. After 20 to 50 miles re torque the lugs. After 150 miles re torque the lugs and you are done. To date I have never had any of the lugs loosen between the miles when I re torqued them. I have found that the cone lug nuts do tend to "bite" into the wheels and will take a considerable effort to remove them far above the actual torque value.

As a further bit of info I caution anyone who has a shop change their tires to watch the placement of the jack. If they are going to lift one wheel make sure they place the jack under the spring mount at the axle. Placing the jack under the bare axle inside the spring (closer to center)WILL bend the axle. They are thin wall tube axles just as the frame is a thin walled rectangular tube. I'm on my second rear axle because of that and it caused me to replace the tires earlier than expected.

I know DRV and Dexter state that to change a tire you are supposed to lift the entire frame but that is hardly likely on the side of the road and most shops are unfamiliar (an unequipped) with that process as well.

ponch · 09-09-2011, 12:02 PM

sorry I didn't pre read.

when you have loosened the nuts and then torqued them back down, drive about 50 miles and tighten them again to spec's.

This will normally set the nut and it should not loosen up.

Aluminum wheels are notorius for loosening up. I always check torque before I leave for a trip. just for safety.

USA in a Chevrolet · 09-09-2011, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ponch

sorry I didn't pre read.

when you have loosened the nuts and then torqued them back down, drive about 50 miles and tighten them again to spec's.

This will normally set the nut and it should not loosen up.

Aluminum wheels are notorius for loosening up. I always check torque before I leave for a trip. just for safety.

Thanks for the edit!

Maverick · 11-09-2011, 09:33 PM

As a further bit of info I caution anyone who has a shop change their tires to watch the placement of the jack. If they are going to lift one wheel make sure they place the jack under the spring mount at the axle. Placing the jack under the bare axle inside the spring (closer to center)WILL bend the axle. They are thin wall tube axles just as the frame is a thin walled rectangular tube. I'm on my second rear axle because of that and it caused me to replace the tires earlier than expected.

NEVER, NEVER JACK ON THE AXLE!!! NO WAY ANY SHAPE OR FORM! THESE AXLES ARE NOT LIKE CAR OR TRUCK AXLE. DEXTER RECOMENDS ALWAYS LIFT WITH THE FRAME! WHEN YOU JACK ON AN AXLE YOU ARE ACUALLY LIFTING 1/2 OF THE RIGS WEIGHT. IF YOU ASK DEXTER THEY WILL BACK ME UP. I JUST ATTENDED A RALLY IN GOSHEN, IN.

Motor31 · 11-10-2011, 10:47 AM

First off Mav, lose the all caps, it's rude to "shout".

Secondly you cannot lift half the weight on the trailer by jacking one side of one axle as half the weight of the trailer is not on one axle. You are only lifting the quarter weight that is supported by the tire on that side of the axle. Should you try to lift both axles on one side you would then be correct however it is not necessary to do so to just clear a flat tire from the surface of the road.

Thirdly you are not going to be able to lift the trailer frame should you have a flat on the side of the road unless you have a system that allows the entire rig to be lifted like a secondary hydraulic lift. Should you require that kind of operation you will only be able to have the trailer loaded on a flat bed trailer then taken to a shop. Frankly I'd love to see something like that tried. It would be interesting to see how the tow truck would move a 5th wheel trailer, without a crane and sling straps, onto a flat bed. It would also require an oversize permit for height as well as all the other requirements for moving an oversize load on the roadway.

In a perfect world you would be able to lift the frame any time you needed to change a tire but then again in a perfect world you would not have a flat.

Maverick · 11-10-2011, 12:26 PM

Sorry about the caps... Did not know.

Submitted by rlgetman on 08-12-2011, 08:20 AM
I have talked with the Dexter axle people and reviewed the Mobile Suites instructions and it seems the only proper way to lift and remove a tire is by the 5er frame near the spring connection and never under the wheel spring or axle. This means I should avoiding buying a single wheel ramp because I would then be supporting the entire 5er side on a single axle. The total (unloaded) weight on both axles is 12.5K (front is 5.6K, rear is 6.9K). I plan on purchasing a 12K bottle jack so that I can lift the 5er properly. Question: Is it okay to lift with one jack behind the rear wheel and bring both wheels off the ground or would this be too much stress on the frame at one point? When I had my tires replaced at POMPS, they used 2 jacks, one in front and one in back of the two axles lifting both wheels by lifting the frame at the two points. Thanks

If you read the manuals and talk to the right people you get the correct answers.

Lippert's manual says "lift unit by the frame and never the axle or suspension" period. Read it here (http://www.lci1.com/OwnersManuals/Tr...20Axle-web.pdf).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motor31

First off Mav, lose the all caps, it's rude to "shout".

Secondly you cannot lift half the weight on the trailer by jacking one side of one axle as half the weight of the trailer is not on one axle. You are only lifting the quarter weight that is supported by the tire on that side of the axle. Should you try to lift both axles on one side you would then be correct however it is not necessary to do so to just clear a flat tire from the surface of the road.

Thirdly you are not going to be able to lift the trailer frame should you have a flat on the side of the road unless you have a system that allows the entire rig to be lifted like a secondary hydraulic lift. Should you require that kind of operation you will only be able to have the trailer loaded on a flat bed trailer then taken to a shop. Frankly I'd love to see something like that tried. It would be interesting to see how the tow truck would move a 5th wheel trailer, without a crane and sling straps, onto a flat bed. It would also require an oversize permit for height as well as all the other requirements for moving an oversize load on the roadway.

In a perfect world you would be able to lift the frame any time you needed to change a tire but then again in a perfect world you would not have a flat.

**wingnut60** · 11-10-2011, 01:49 PM

I would think there are a lot of people with all types of trailers (like me) who are going to suffer failed frames, blown tires and maybe acne, from raising one tire by placing a bottle/floor jack under one spring pad and lifting the subject tire off the ground.

I agree you should never place a jack directly onto an axle tube, but to say you will ruin something by using the spring pad just has not been shown to cause problems--that I have heard of on any of the forums.

If you are going to use a frame mount to raise one tire off the ground, I would think it might possibly cause some frame stress by the time you get it high enough to remove the tire.

I imagine (can't prove anything, tho) that more stress is placed daily on the tires/wheels/axles by road conditions than would ever be caused by jacking on the spring pad. Some of the potholes that we can't miss surely are causing more impact force than just jacking on the spring pad. Will test this theory next summer on my Alaska trip...

My story, and I'm sticking to it.

Joe

5thwheeler · 11-10-2011, 02:11 PM

Level-Up System is great for changing tires.

Put extra blocks under the jacks on one side, then manually adjust the opposite side jacks to raise trailer.

Changed out all four tires.

jas24 · 11-10-2011, 02:15 PM

I agree with Joe as far as placing the jack under the spring pad.

You would need a whole bunch of blocks to jack it under the frame.

jas24 · 11-10-2011, 02:23 PM

Has anyone tried the hydraulic jacks we have on DRV's to raise the tires off the ground?

The service guy when I bought mine said you could, but I have never tried it.
(I don't think he knew if you could or not)

**wingnut60** · 11-10-2011, 06:09 PM

If you have just the 4-point standard jacks, then NO. If you have the LevelUp system, it can be used raise all 4 wheels off the ground.
The standard rear jacks are designed as stabilizers, not lifting jacks.
Joe

The View 5046 · 11-10-2011, 10:30 PM

This past Sept I used the Level up System 6 hydraulic when I removed the tires and had them all balanced all 4 tires were take off and the Level up System supported all the weight. My tire man loves the Level up... And when you replace the wheels make sure you use a Torq wrench to torq the wheels run for awhile (30 miles and again at 75 miles and recheck) I then pulled down to Sebring Florida and all lugs are tight.. Happy Trails....

bstark · 11-12-2011, 10:45 AM

While this thread has been high-jacked (pun intended) to an extent; I'll nevertheless add my input:

Lippert/Dexter/and DRV are advising you from a purely mechanical component integrity viewpoint and NOT necessarliy for real world usage of these units.

Their approach is to protect themselves from a warranty or any failure claim arising PERHAPS from mis-use of a jack to raise one wheel.

For those of us who've actually attempted to raise the entire side of the rig off the ground using two identical tall boy jacks placed adjacent to the rear most and front most hangers; it's nearly an impossible task for those who travel without two TALL hydrualic or air/over hydraulic jacks.

My truck was an international toter with the ability to carry a number of air operated hydraulic jacks and I routinely carried a 20 ton stubby for getting under the axle of the front axle of my toter in the event of a flat steer tire and I also carried two identical 20 ton air operated tall boys for the purpose of jacking the entire side of the trailer to change a tire without having to use much "cribbing" under the jacks to complete the task.

I attempted this once in a rest stop of I-40 near Tulsa and would NEVER do so again. I instead completed the wheel change-out using the stubby under the spring perch, lifting the wheel only as far as was necessary to clear the ground.

Firstly jacks and cribbing necessary to lift one side of the trailer high enough to compensate for the spring sag of both axle ends to clear the tire off the ground are extensive and add additional weight to your CCWR that would be better used to take weight off the combo.

Secondly getting that thing high enough in the air to clear the affected tire is darn dangerous having it sitting on the tops of those two jack pads at an angle.

Thirdly for those who've used an emergency call -out company; did they, or did they not, jack under the axle spring perch and probably outright REFUSE to jack the entire side of the rig; ESPECIALLY if performing this exercise on the side of a busy highway.

Done carefully no damage should result because you are merely lifting the thing at the very same point the weight of the trailer for that wheel is tranferred through the spring to the axle. You are also not lifting that tire any more than it would be lifted transiting any campground speed bump.

In short; while it is all very well for ALL company's involved in mitigating damage caused to suspension components, axles, springs or hangers. In the real world it just isn't practical to carry all the necessary crap you'd need to perform this maneouver on the side of a highway in a safe and secure manner.

I'm with Mike and Joe on this one from personal experience having dealt with two tire failures while en-rout AND having enough equipment to perform the task as suggested but opting for the spring perch regardless due to expediancy and safety.

**wingnut60** · 11-12-2011, 11:58 AM

Don't believe it could be said any better...

Joe

billr · 11-13-2011, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bstark

While this thread has been high-jacked (pun intended) to an extent; I'll nevertheless add my input:

Lippert/Dexter/and DRV are advising you from a purely mechanical component integrity viewpoint and NOT necessarliy for real world usage of these units.

Their approach is to protect themselves from a warranty or any failure claim arising PERHAPS from mis-use of a jack to raise one wheel.

For those of us who've actually attempted to raise the entire side of the rig off the ground using two identical tall boy jacks placed adjacent to the rear most and front most hangers; it's nearly an impossible task for those who travel without two TALL hydrualic or air/over hydraulic jacks.

My truck was an international toter with the ability to carry a number of air operated hydraulic jacks and I routinely carried a 20 ton stubby for getting under the axle of the front axle of my toter in the event of a flat steer tire and I also carried two identical 20 ton air operated tall boys for the purpose of jacking the entire side of the trailer to change a tire without having to use much "cribbing" under the jacks to complete the task.

I attempted this once in a rest stop of I-40 near Tulsa and would NEVER do so again. I instead completed the wheel change-out using the stubby under the spring perch, lifting the wheel only as far as was necessary to clear the ground.

Firstly jacks and cribbing necessary to lift one side of the trailer high enough to compensate for the spring sag of both axle ends to clear the tire off the ground are extensive and add additional weight to your CCWR that would be better used to take weight off the combo.

Secondly getting that thing high enough in the air to clear the affected tire is darn dangerous having it sitting on the tops of those two jack pads at an angle.

Thirdly for those who've used an emergency call -out company; did they, or did they not, jack under the axle spring perch and probably outright REFUSE to jack the entire side of the rig; ESPECIALLY if performing this exercise on the side of a busy highway.

Done carefully no damage should result because you are merely lifting the thing at the very same point the weight of the trailer for that wheel is tranferred through the spring to the axle. You are also not lifting that tire any more than it would be lifted transiting any campground speed bump.

In short; while it is all very well for ALL company's involved in mitigating damage caused to suspension components, axles, springs or hangers. In the real world it just isn't practical to carry all the necessary crap you'd need to perform this maneouver on the side of a highway in a safe and secure manner.

I'm with Mike and Joe on this one from personal experience having dealt with two tire failures while en-rout AND having enough equipment to perform the task as suggested but opting for the spring perch regardless due to expediancy and safety.

Not bad Bruce! For a Florida ranch resident! :lol: I agree completly. Use the spring plate, no issue. I have had to raise the entire side to replce a spring and had to use everything I carry and then some (big 8X8 blocks from the campground) I do carry a 15T Hyd and 20T Air/Hyd jack.

Bill